The Sins of Scripture

Surveying the great conflicts in western history, we can see the Bible playing a central role, if not a supporting one. For instance, the Bible was used to oppose the Magna Carta and support the divine right of kings, to condemn the insights of Galileo and Charles Darwin, and to support slavery and later apartheid and segregation. Christian leaders used the Bible to justify the Crusades and their unspeakable horrors against Muslim peoples, as well as the murderous behavior of the Inquisition and the virulent anti-semitism of the Holocaust. The Bible is still quoted in the church to justify treating women as 2nd-class citizens. Today it is the chief weapon of politicians and preachers seeking to deny justice for gay and lesbian people. In addition, the Christian church, while claiming allegiance to this book, has encouraged the abuse of children and supported environmental degradation. How can a book called "The Word of God" leave a trail of such violence, hostility, and death throughout it's history?

This central question is covered by Episcopal Bishop, John Shelby Spong in his thought provoking book, The Sins of Scripture

I thought this channel of the forum would be a good place to present this inquiry for further discussion.

And i'll start off with one of my own.
Has the bible been used for more good then bad in the world, or visa versa?

[edit on 22-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

To me it is all in how you look at it. The Bible has more power to destroy or help those who have read it. The bible did not kill or hurt anyone it was the people who read it and acted upon what they thought it said. Just because someone tells you to do this it is still your decision to do so. The Bible is read by many different people and has a power but can not be blamed for how people act.

I was coming from the perspective of the Bible being an instruction manual of sorts, that gives direction/meaning/purpose to life. When you have schools, churches and bible study groups assisting/encouraging people to apply the scriptures/values to ones life... it gives shape to every aspect of our lives; from our foreign policies we embrace to the quality of treatment we show our fellow wo/man; minorities, foreigners, sexual orientations, agnostics/atheists/other-religion-believers etc

Free-will to be a free-thinker is not always an option. The bulk of followers subscribe to the sermon of their choice, but "choice" is not exact the right word to describe the introduction of scripture to let's say a grade schooler. Children generally absorb everything like a sponge... with this fact in view you could say that "free-will to be a free-thinker" is not an option, for before someone has had a chance to formulate their own thoughts and opinions of the world they have already been handed a filter through which to see the world in a certain way. In other words, limiting the scope from which one sees reality.



[edit on 23-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

But it is not just the Bible that is the problem. There are those who have not even read the bible that has the same values of the Bible. I was raised in a semi-religious household. I know most of what the bible says and I still make my own choices. I know alot of what i do is not looked upon with favor by others. Both chirstian or otherwise. I am just saying you can make the some choices no matter what book you have read. Be it the bible or the koran or whatever. People just use the bible or whatever to justify their actions. Even if the bible did not exist we would be having this dicussion about some other book. Or would we I do not know.

The Bible plays many different roles...

1. Bible and Pastor as a guide from which people shape their lives and the lives of their children.

2. People using the Bible as a tool to manipulate the masses (see 1)

3. People using the Bible to justify their character flaws

and as you eloquently pointed out...
we can see the same influencing factors at work in other religious scriptures... whether it be the koran, bhagavad gita, tanakh or dianetics... so i think you may be right... we would most likely create another oracle and misuse it in similar ways.

Though i think the devil is revealed in how each religion...
despite their similarities have also created many differences in the values and perspectives of their followers. In other words, muslims, christains, jews, hindus, buddists, scientologists all have varying ideals, which have been expressed throughout history in varying degrees of good and bad deeds.

So for those of you who think i am singling out the Bible, you are right, but not for the reasons you may be assuming. It just happens to be one of the most influential books in all of history.




[edit on 25-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

this about sums it up lol

reply to post by The All Seeing I

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No, it doesn't 'sum' it up.
The Old Testament had certain laws that were changed when the Temple in Jerusalem was misused and later destroyed.
Life has all those things written on that fallacious warning label, yet, we still live it.
How in the world was early America not turned into a horrible, den of wickedness with all the Bibles in school?

Please elaborate... i am a bit confused?

Are you suggesting that there was once a better version of the bible and if the better version was untouched we would have a better script from which to guide or lives... in turn making a better world?

As for "early America not turned into a horrible, den of wickedness with all the Bibles in school?" ...suggests that you think the bible kept this country on a higher ground. Though i see the bible was used in large part to justify our treatment of the indians, african slaves, women... all three pretty horrible and wicked in my opinion.


[edit on 26-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

reply to post by The All Seeing I

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The wars between the indians and the settlers was a sad story of both sides.
I am part Cherokee, but, I know of the atrocities on BOTH sides.

In Jamestown, I believe there were NO slaves at first.
Four centuries

There were also indentured Irish, English and others servants, but, not usually by Puritans, Pilgrims or Quakers, that I know of.

How were women abused at large, in your opinion?
You also have to note that not all newcomers were even nominally Christian.

( en.wikipedia.org... )

as for women...
( www.historyofquilts.com... )

...and i think the "Salem witch trials" provides an accurate picture of the mentality of the day. Charges of witchcraft were a way of controlling women who threatened the existing economic and social order.

[edit on 26-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

From another angle, and yet just as valid a point if not more dire/important is this acknowledgement...

The Bible tells us to be like God, and then on page after page it describes God as a mass murderer. This may be the single most important key to the political behavior of Western Civilization. ~Robert Anton Wilson

Ran across this interesting quote today...

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."
- Steven Weinberg -

...though i think it could be said that religion has changed some evil people for the better. The temptation of heaven and threat of hell are strong motivators for many. Yet i question how good of a person is ... if these are hidden motives to push people to "act" good.

reply to post by The All Seeing I

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I'd argue that all those horrors and abuses came about because people were NOT following the teachings of Christ.

I mean, I can say I follow Islam, but If my actions are 100% contrary to the teachings of Mohammad what would you call me?

A liar? Most likely so.

NOTurTypical... i think you have some explaining to do.
What is the meaning of your post when your BTS points mark the sign of the beast? lol



... all joking a side, i agree in part with your premise. Though there are some exceptions. Here are a couple youtube videos that do a good job of pointing out where some of jesus's teachings are a miss.

Jesus said it, but he didn't mean it.

Jesus was Wrong, Part 1

Jesus was Wrong, Part 2

Jesus was Wrong, Part 3

Jesus was Wrong, Part 4

Jesus was Wrong, Part 5

[edit on 13-10-2008 by The All Seeing I]

reply to post by The All Seeing I

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Eeeeeeeeeeek!!! LOL.

The videos don't work.


U2U me the actual links if you wish.


(Also tell me how you embed the videos, plz, thx.)