Again this is the most worst crime that can be inflicted on a helpless child.

Here is a Link. cnn.netscape.cnn.com.../ff/story/0001%2F20050207%2F215
5340979.htm&sc=1110

Now the story...

Texas Couple Accused of Abusing Infant

By PAM EASTON

HOUSTON (AP) - A young couple are accused of critically injuring their 6-month-old baby, who police say was sexually assaulted, suffered broken bones from head to toe, and had her tongue nearly severed.

Donna Marie Norman, 19, and her common-law husband, Ivan Castaneda, 21, were jailed without bail on charges of causing injury to a child.

The infant lay in critical condition Monday at a hospital. She was transferred there last week after her parents brought her to another hospital, saying she was suffering from congestion.

Child Protective Services spokeswoman Estella Olguin said the baby had been sexually abused, had two broken legs, a broken arm, a fractured skull, a fractured vertebrae and a broken rib.


``Just about every vital organ in this child's body has damage to it,'' said Houston police Sgt. Randall Upton. ``This child endured probably some of the most incredible amount of pain that one could imagine.''


Olguin said that if the little girl survives she could be blind or paralyzed.


Norman told doctors the infant's tongue was severed when she tried to remove a quarter from the baby's mouth that had been placed there by her 15-month-old sister, prosecutor Kari Allen said


``Obviously, that is a bit far-fetched,'' Allen told a judge at a hearing Monday.


The 6-month-old and her sister, who also had a fractured skull and ribs, were taken into state custody.


Norman was ``obviously upset about the situation that has happened to her family and to herself and to her children,'' her attorney Jerald Graber said. He said he had not yet talked to Norman about the facts of the case.


Castaneda asked for additional time to hire an attorney.



02/07/05 21:55



My God people
What can we do to prevent this, I'm so sicken by this that I just want to hurt those so called parents, that I hate myself for it! Man this hurts!

Sorry Mod's, I put this into the wrong Forum, please put it wherre it needs to be, Thanks

[edit on 8-2-2005 by jessemole]

The really scary thing is people can perpretrate these crimes and get get away with it, scott free. Society has some major problems when courts feel you are justified in child abuse or child murder.

EDIT: missed a bracket

[edit on 2-8-2005 by junglejake]

I think these pustules on the arse of humanity should receive life imprisonment with no chance of parole.

It should be served in a nice dark, dank, mould encrusted, rat infested mediaeval dungeon complete with en-suite torture chamber.

Yes Piskey, my thoughts as well, As mention in one of JungleJake threads on a similar topic. Let's pray for that child, for she will never know or live a fair and good life as a result of these Monster.... Hold me back, hold me because I want to hurt them to a point where there crippled for the rest of their worthless lifes. Sorry, this issue takes me over the Top!

I want to push this topic alittle more, considering it's needs to be done. I will refer back to what I said one other time. But before I do, I tend to believe we are not looking to resolve this, what ever protection and those that are in a position to take notice needs to be dealt with, Some of our policies are worthless, as well as the people we have put into positions that have us, no not us, but the child's welfare in mind... when it comes down to it, Isee them looking at it as a job, not a purpose! Here is one that I want to start off with, however I will continue to populate this thread with other replys that I have made in other threads with hopes to Enlighten.

Child Abuse, it's a scar that will continue to repeat itself as a result of ones upbringing, I came from a very ugly childhood, I experence a great deal of it along with my Brouther/and Sisters as well. I don't wish to go into details of it, but take my word for it I know, and feel the pain all over again when I hear of these cases of abuse... God it hurts!
However, it had such a profound affect on me as a child that even then at the age 8 years old I made a promise to myself, it happens to be the only one that I know never broke... (for myself) I will " Never " let the fear/pain/hunger/shame/neglect ever come to my child... I knew then how to change it.... Never repeat it for it was wrong... so wrong I hated my parents for a very long time, It took me into my adulthood to get over that hate. I had to get over it, and did..... But what help was knowing I did not have qualified _Parent's, Yes thats the difference and I stand by that assistment.... we have people that walk this earth that has no ability to raise children and should be deprived of that right... Sorry it's true!
It seems that we have a License for just about everything esle in this world or a degree or some form to be qualified for what we do except for Bringing children into this world and and provide for them as Parents.. It's a tough call, but I could make it! To be honest, I glad the doctor that delivered my sisters baby could see that she was a unfit mother and took steps to see the right people knew about it right out the gate... Thank God for his insight and caring deed. Now that child stands a chance! Was it her fault? no, it was my parents, My other Sister, abused her children similar to our upbringing (I was not aware of it she lived out of state or I would of done something about it) And end up to realize that when I went to her Wake... she drank herself to death... (could not go over her past) I could go on about this all night but I must stop now... If I don't, I feel hate going into these fingers and I don't want to repeat that, I perfer to keep it in a repress Gray Matter that it never belong there in the first place.

Any suggestion to resolve this? I have many!
Jesse

Things like that make me want to throw up, hurt the parents and take the baby home and love it.

I really cannot fathom how evil a human has to be to do such a thing to their own child. I can't even fathom being abusive to an animal

llpoolej. You are someone who cares.... There is not enough of us that do!

Sorry for posting a one liner, okay maybe it won't be, but if this effort alone will get more of a response, in which I'm looking for. After all, looking at the View's, and no replies, it's so sad that as Humans, we fail to protect what we can!
Yes, this is one aspect of a NWO that I could agree on... So far this abuse is out of order... and out of control! We have monsters around us.. those are the one's that need to be dealt with, to enculd those that let it happen.
Money is going into the wrong pockets folks... At what cost, with no results?

honestly the revival of the dungeon is long over due, since when are the people we regard as criminals subject to a life of luxery that some in the third world can only pray for? dig a freking hole in the ground throw them all in and let them have their way with one another, i would be happy to dig the hole as well, i need a little a work out from browsing the net all day long. let them eat fish heads. when the first inmate is realeased, and gets word back to his hommies that the life of crime is substantially not worth it, then perhaps; no, absolutly crime will completly diminish in our society.

This is for all the posters who think Jail is like a visit to a badly decorated motel. Let's clear up some misconceptions real quick.

Only white collar jails are nicer than third world countries. I'll take savannah and the darkest congo jungle over one night in an overcrowded, AIDS infested, drug saturated, concrete box, getting raped, humiliated, dehumanized and beaten, by guards and inmates both. The day you get locked up by accident and spend all night in hell, getting your teeth knocked out so you can give sloppy head to a dozen grinning gorillas, that's the day I take you seriously when you say jail isn't tough enough.

Do you know what they do to child molesters and abusive parents in prison? It's not pleasant. On the food chain, they are at the bottom - everybody's bitch.

People are obviously going insane, record numbers of them! Let's do something about that problem instead of creating another similarly insane situation. If we have to lock people up, we need to decide as a culture whether we still care about their well being. If we don't, we might as well kill them and save the resources necessary to maintain their life. If we don't want to kill them, should we torture them? If you endorse torture, then you should like the current system just fine. If you think people can be rehabilitated, and I think some can, the current system is useless and far too costly for its problems.

I've known guards, inmates, a warden and several CJ majors who decided they wanted to work in prison dynamics, inmate interactions, and prison architecture. We did a lot of research, and came to the conclusion that jails are incapable of accomplishing their stated goals with their current designs, programs, and employees. There are several Jail of the Future projects underway now, maybe one of them will be universally adopted and prove a success. One can only hope.

I sympathize with England, using Australia as a prison. If it weren't already spoken for I might suggest the exact same thing. Exile seems to be the best of a lot of bad choices, but that's just my opinion. Exile allows the prosecutor to keep his hands clean, allows society a relief from their burden, and allows the prisoners a chance to fight for their life outside of society, in the wild, like the animals they have chosen to become.

Seriously though, any who think that jail isn't tough enough, spend a night in one. Spend five years in Rikers for that matter, or do a dime in Bakersfield. You won't have so much to say, I am sure.

Unfortunately the court will never approve torture, so I have an idea. We'll break these people out of jail and help them skip the country... and promptly sell them as slaves in the Sudan where they can endure a very short lifetime of pain, work, and probably rape in the mother's case.
On second thought, since Muslims don't rape men maybe we should send the father to prison here in America after all and bribe guards and inmates to make his stay less enjoyable.

I daresay they are tough compared to many other contemporary prisons but believe me when I say that they are nothing when compared to a Mediaeval dungeon. It was rare for people to survive those for more than a few years - and that was without the other 'inmates' animosity.

And even worse ...

Imagine being stuffed into a small hole in the ground of the dungeon. This hole is just big enough to crouch into. You can't sit, you can't stand, you can't stetch your legs. You are stuck in this hole and the barred lid is locked tightly. If you are lucky, water and what passes for food is occasionally thrown down to you. No toilet either. Thats the Oubliette. Once you went down there you stayed there until you died.

I think given the choice most prisoners would even prefer Rikers Island or Bakersville than the Oubliette.

Why in the bloody hell would you want food or water. If you can let yourself die within the week I say do it. By the end of 2 and a half days without food or water, time sorta seems to speed up because distinct thoughts about deprivation sort of merge into a general state of mind, causing you to lose track of the time between re-cycles in your throughts of wanting. Nevermind why I was stupid enough to gain this knowledge.

Come to think of it... it's a lot like not having sex. The misery of it grows exponentially for a while, then after a month or two it doesn't mount quite so swiftly... until of course you know it's almost over. The first two and last one weeks of being in a sexless environment are far and away the hardest. That's just one of many reasons that I'd prefer to be imprisoned in a sex free environment if I ever comitted a crime.

(hows that for a tangent?)

Whatevers happens after the fact that you do a crime, has no need to be here. Those that choosen to inflict harm to any child, and all others made a choice to do so. There always needs to be a result that if you fail to make a good choice, you will suffer!, The pain will never be the same as for a child that will go through the horrors that we let go on. We need to prevent this, if not it will only serve to have it repeated again, and again!

I detect within some of these threads a first hand experence in being Confine for your past, or know by others that have did time for their choices. Thats need's to be known, but it appears to be little deterent for some.

A new meaning needs to become of this saying... Child Watch! And extend that into all of our daily living... And don't give up once you have a questionable concern. I have no problem in putting those that are unfit into question, for the sake of the child! Just my priorities! Where is your's in getting this done?

Maybe that Child/Adult will Thank You one day! There is a Concept, and worth the risk.

I could of gone all day without that! A warning on this thread title would of been nice as the current title does not denote what it is about!

I have never been imprisoned or confined (definitely not in a mediaeval dungeon). My knowledge of mediaeval England comes from many years of research and love for history. My hatred for child abuse comes from basic humanity and from being a Samaritan volunteer. During my time there, I met too many people who were abused as children. I have had grown men and women sobbing in the visitor's rooms as they explain what they suffered as kids. This kind of thing lasts a lifetime.

I used to think that every home was like mine, caring, peaceful and kind but now I know better. I think that everyone deserves a childhood like the one I had and if putting child abusers down a rat-infested dark stinking hole will help, then the sooner we start doing it, the better.

But of course the PC bastards won't let us do that will they - They are more sympathetic towards the perpetrator than the victim. Here's an idea - lets stuff them in the dungeon too and rid the world of both kinds of scum at the same time.

I wouldn't say I have "prison" experience. I have been in trouble and been a detainee in corrective custody while I was in the Marines. Did a little hard labor, had a few fights- won some, lost some. Most importantly everyone in that lockup was observing celibacy. For what little experience that was, I'd say it pretty well fit my crime, but I sure hope that hardened predators don't get it so easy.
And as has been said, what is going on in prison doesn't seem to be deterring some people. Some people become "products of the system" or "institutionalized". There are people out there who do not care if they go to jail. I remember trying to calm a guy I knew down from a fight once, and he looked me right in the eyes and said with complete honesty "I don't care if my PO does find out, I'm gonna (do bad things to that bad person)."

That sort of thing needs to be stopped. When somebody is saying "i dont care if i go back to jail" he should be thinking... oh wait a minute, after your third strike they impale you on a spit and slow roast you while playing Britney Spears music... maybe I do care afterall.
We need some serious deterrence against the hardened criminals.

The Vagabond, and Pisky, Thank you for putting your feelings in print.. Pisky. your first hand observation of sorrow, I feel it as well in your words.
Yes, Vagabond your right when it comes to a point that when the person your looking at in the eye's make's a statment that their going to bring harm to someone because their considered a bad person in their opinion, or whatever drove them to feel this way towards that person... it stem's from deep seated hate, as result of their upbringing or lack of.
I'd suggest that you take a position in his/her voiced concern/threat, and watch it closley. Thanks again Vagabond. for sharing that time you spent in confinement, and walked away from it as a better person. You have made a good choice because you can, as a result of that experence, I don't think you wish to repeat it.... So sad that many others don't factor that in. As simple as it is... We have two choices, Some have choosen incorrectly, regardless of their/your past!

Death. I know a lot of people aren't into the death penalty, but honestly, this type of sub-human creature does not need to continue living. The people who do this type of thing are not going to rehabilitate or ever become anything useful to society. Period. They don't need to be supported for life, either. And as much as people THINK bad things happen to child abusers, it's not true. I know someone who is now rotting away in his 3rd institution on a bad rap (yes, some of them ARE wrongly detained), and he said they do nothing to inmates brought in on sex raps with kids. In fact, he was jailed with a mexican who was in for raping an 8 year old girl and they asked him how it was. In another institution, you only got a hard time if you were a white pedophile.

It's probably not going to be any more popular this time than the last time I posted here, but I believe there are certain criminals who should simply be eliminated. They will not become upstanding citizens. They will not become a comfort to anyone in their golden years. They are defective and since they are beyond repair, they should be disposed of. Death.

torque, yes, there is a time we need to look at those that are beyound repair, for whatever reasons..... Were better off without them in the normal excentence (sp) that we perfer to have... granted, each one of those that have choosen to take a demented effort to exist, and repeat their past, needs to be dealt with right now. But at the same time, effort must be made for those that have come throught this uglyness, They are the one's that can prevent it from happening again.
It's painful to realize, as a result of no effort to see this... it will result in more suffering!, In short a repeat of the past! I have made it a point, if I don't agree with what I see is right, (towards any child) threaten those that have brought it upon themselfs, and us!, but more importantly, The Child that is depended on Who? A unfit Parent/relative/ the monster next door....None of them!!
It come's from you! To assist in realizing something new, and right for that child.
I'd take great pride in knowing that I put someone out of reach of that threat for all of us!
Right down to the so call Protective Services that allow it to happen... Piss Poor Performance on their behalf... and were paying for it. Where is there a passion? In what has only been proven, (in most cases) it's only a Job/Paycheck! Now there is a Waste of effort and resources! I'd fire everyone of them... faster then any childs Tear's that were to drop unnoticed! Sorry, at time's I going over the top on this, I have little control of that.

But at time's, I feel I live around Born Again Idiot's that fail to realize what's important. (Not directing that commit towards anyone here on this thread... ) but a over all lack of those that can't see it.
Jesse.





[edit on 12-2-2005 by jessemole]

If there was any Agent/Gov/State person(s) that you would wish to direct any suggestion(s), What would you express? Who knows... it could be seen as a valid point! Right now this effort has gone unseen!